In a disturbing case in Georgia, four members of a so-called "right-to-die" organization have been indicted by a grand jury on charges of helping a man commit suicide.
Though all such "assisted-suicide" cases are troubling, what makes this one more so is that the man who died was not terminally ill. He had cancer, but his physician said he was not dying. To the contrary, he was recovering, according to authorities.
That highlights a serious argument against assisted suicide: Opening the door to assisted suicide for those who are dying is in fact a slippery slope toward "helping" others -- who may not be near death -- into an early grave.
Indeed, one of the men set to be arraigned next month in Forsyth County, Ga., near Atlanta, told The Associated Press last year that even sick people who are not dying need the group's "support" in committing suicide.
The suspects have not been proved guilty, and they deserve their day in court. But the accusations leveled by Georgia authorities are alarming. Authorities say the man who died had a hood -- a so-called "exit bag" -- secured over his head. Helium was pumped in to kill him. Officials say helium was used because it cannot be detected in an autopsy.
The Georgia Bureau of Investigation says the group, called the Final Exit Network, also discussed its methods with an undercover agent, who told the organization he wanted to die because he had pancreatic cancer. One of the suspects "walked the undercover agent through the steps that would have killed him," the AP reported. The suspect "allegedly demonstrated how he would hold down the agent's hands to prohibit him from removing the 'exit bag.'"
That sounds like something out of a horror movie.
Suicide is a tragedy under any circumstances. It certainly ought not to be encouraged or aided in any way. That is especially true when a person is sick -- terminally or otherwise -- and may not be thinking clearly.
It is for a court to determine whether the suspects are guilty. If they are found guilty, they should be punished to the fullest extent of the law.
Is suicide illegal?
I have long thought that under certain circumstances,I would want the suicide option available. I can imagine saying farewell to my loved ones and dying on my own terms. It seems very civilized to me,depending on prognosis,pain,and circumstance.
Some states are beginning to discuss right-to-die issues. Oregon has such a law. Switzerland and Holland have forms of assisted suicide.
And,of course,Hospice often administers enough morphine near the end to give you a loving shove past the finish line,but we shouldn't talk about that.
How dare you nucanuck or anyone else mention HOSPICE in the same breath with assisted suicide? Their role is to involve comfort. If you think they just give medicine to dull the pain, you need to go spend time with a worker as they lovingly watch someone's life ebb away who values life enough to not take the "suicide option" you seem to want. I have personally been there and seen what hospice does. It surely does not condone what you are suggesting in conjunction with assited suicide. Oregon, Switzerland, Holland are all awaiting you if you need to go. We do not need this stuff and what it will ultimately lead to around here.
Livn,I am a great admirer of Hospice and what they do. With that said,doctors and hospice make decisions every day at the end of life that facilitate,if you will,the inevitable. I don't offer that as an indictment,but as a humane simple statement of fact.
My point,however inelegantly put, is that at the terminal phase of life decisions are made that ease us into death and those decisions are really not so different from someone wishing to end the process somewhat earlier. The person dying deserves a voice if they wish to die on their own terms.
Livin, I too have had an experience with hospice in regards to my mother in law. Hospice provides a wonderful service but at least in her case, near the end she was practically comatose with morphine. Otherwise the pain would have been unbearable. Since that time, Hospice of Chattanooga is my largest local charity donation.
I am in total agreement though with nucanuck on having the right to decide when you wish to quit this world if you do not wish to unnecessarily suffer. I would like to have the right to curtail MY suffering without anyone feeling the necessity to prolong it from THEIR ethical and/or religious opinions. Of course my being an atheist perhaps makes my decision a lot easier than someone of faith. Jeez, people want to rule your life all the way to the grave, LOL.
Count me in as a supporter of the Oregon, Switzerland, Holland model, and let ME make the decision. I have supported their philosophy for quite some time.
More ignorance from the ignoble. 'Giving me the right to die' sounds nice and good and unselfish, doesn't it? Trouble is, nasty little human follies and fickleness keep messing up in Utopia, as the above article aptly notes.
After spending many a day with the dying, in America and in Canada, with family and friends over the decades, I can speak with more knowledge than ignorance. Morphine does indeed hasten death and causes nightmares or hallucinations in many, yet alleviates pain and should be given in small doses, if at all. In Canada, in many provinces, where there are critical hospital bed shortages, shortages of medical staff, and just plain shortage of money, death is indeed hastened. I mentioned on more than one occasion to a physician or nurse, that increasing the morphine doses to huge levels is akin to Euthanasia, or as the more delicate like to put it, "helping the patient along". The truth and the cold, hard facts are and will be, that when a "health" system cannot sustain itself because it never receives enough moolah from the taxpayers to feed its bottomless pit, well then, people have to die.
In a Socialist/Progressive Utopia, the most vulnerable (ie the unborn, the disabled and the old) must go. The most "unproductive" of us will just have to choose that old, unselfish "right to die" path.
And no matter how much you guys try to couch this issue in nice, Progressive code-talk, it still means to the rest of us with opened eyes, those who have walked the walk and lived with the lies, you will coldly and dispassionately stand by, while millions of your fellow citizens die. Die for the glory of the State! Die for the glory of Progress! Die because we hate your views and your Religion! Tell me, oh sage ones, what's next on your little agenda?
Good grief, canary. No one is promoting euthanasia on this thread. This is assisted suicide, a thoroughly personal decision. I don't agree with you regarding the morphine. In the cases of severe lung disease, cancer, congestive heart failure and others, only morphine can relieve the sense that one is drowning or unable to breathe. This feeling is very frightening, and a slow suffocation is a pretty horrible way to go. In some circumstances only a lethal dose can relieve the sensation.
No matter what your views are, get a living will. As soon as you can. That way, your desires about how you are treated, in the event that you are unable to communicate, conforms with what YOU want. My sibling is a caseworker, and has seen senile 90+ year olds whose bodies are shutting down endure expensive, painful, fruitless attempts to add hours or days to their lives. To die with dignity and without pain is the best anyone can ask for, but you must ask while you can. I would not want my children to face making that decision for me, so I make it now, legally, in writing.
Good grief yourself, again I say, for all your 'claimed' intelligence, you cannot read too well, eh? All the posts on this thread, except for Livn's were indeed excusing/apologizing and/or justifying Euthanasia aka "right to die" in some circles-what in tarnation did you get out of the above article? People in the "right to die" movement believe in Euthanasia and Physicians/nurses practice it in many places, some of them thinking it's "all for the best" or "the patient would have wanted it this way". These are the 'nice' words of the amoral and the corrupted immorals-like your posts and the ones above eschew.
In your ignorance, you forgot to mention the FACTS I stated in my post, namely decades of experience in places where passive/agressive Euthanasia is practiced everyday in hospitals and nursing homes under the aegis of patients "right to die". You have your Atheistic agenda, everyone here already realizes that, but if you lie or misrepresent my words, I will call you on it, schmuck.
There's canary being his (?) charming ole self again....
I can very well see myself, if diagnosed with something like terminal cancer, deciding to die of Excedrin headache number 357 instead, if you get my drift.
My nightmare is being so debilitated that I would be unable to pull the trigger myself and might have to depend on others to carry out my wishes for me. In that case it would certainly be good for the law to be on my side.
canary, you did not address a single thing in my post. Assisted suicide is not euthanasia.
Oh, and I don't see how my being an atheist has anything to do with it.
Can't read guys, eh? Didn't say it was and didn't say people couldn't have a choice to go naturally, or not. But like all the Left-Prog, schmuck thinkers, 'Choice' is for them and not the rest of the undesirables, in their august opinion, that is. btw, I know of a good reading Teacher for you all, Pre-K she is and a very good one at that.
It's been a slice, don't let the door hit you on the way out to La-La Land.
I go to to church every weekend and I believe in God so canary you need to shut your mouth about the aethiests views because religion does not matter for this. If I am dying from cancer or mentally ill to the point that there is no hope for improvement or so depressed that medicine and therapy will not help me I would want the option of euthanasia or assisted suicide. And if you don't agree with my views you can just get over it because it is not directly affecting you. If you don't think euthanasia or assisted suicide are ever an option that is great for you and if you agree that if you get to that point of desperation it's an option that is also great for you. But you need to not talk to people as if they are stupid because you don't agree with their views. And I have personally dealt with a sitution where the most humane thing would have been euthanasia or assisted suicide because not only would my uncle's suffering have ended sooner, but so would have the suffering of everyone else in my family.
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